Healing From Complex Trauma & PTSD/CPTSD

A journey to healing from complex trauma.

Can a narcissist or sociopath, be a Christian?

51 Comments

This is a subject I have been thinking of lately. I know a fair amount about narcissism, and those on the narcissist/sociopath continuum.

I have experienced considerable abuse from several of these. Including within the first 20 years of my life, having to be very hyper vigilant, study them, know their behaviours, know how to assess them, to stay safe, to stay alive.

My understanding of these narcs/sociopaths, is from considerable experience, not just studying psychology.

I can pick up their traits easily, I know what they are driven by – themselves and nothing else.

They have deeply self driven needs they don’t even understand in themselves. They can manipulate easily, lie, have an image built up to hide their deep inner emptiness and shame they can’t bear to acknowledge, so they hide it well, even from themselves.

They have no real empathy and often abuse, with no remorse, no self reflection, always deflecting.

They don’t and won’t change, they can’t, it’s their personality disorder that is formed before adulthood and it cannot be changed. They don’t respond to counselling, they can fake it, but they very rarely change. This is something well known to anyone in the mental health profession about narcissism.

Narcissism/sociopaths are the opposite of humility, opposite of understanding we need Jesus.

It’s why the joke ‘Does anyone know of any good self help books for narcissism’, is sad, because they truly cannot accept they have any issues, or need to change.

They can mimic being a Christian easily, learn all the scripture, have great ability to parrot it all, but with little deep understanding.

They can make what seems to be good pastors, often relying on their charming personality, their humour, their great platform skills, to mimic a pastor, but they are always self led, self serving, adoration seeking, authority driven, and these are their idols, their god.

Expose a narc/sociopath and watch them in action. Rage, denial, attacking, lies, deflecting, hitting the person where it would hurt the most.

I have seen this repeated in my life, I have watched them closely and I know what there are driven by – self.

I know what is their god – self.

With Satan loving it. Satan can use these narcs so easily, that’s why so many end up being abusers. They don’t believe what they are doing is wrong.

I find it hard to believe narcs/sociopaths can be Christians.

They can be believers, but not a Christian, in the true sense, being Christ focussed, as this is the opposite of a narc/sociopath’s deep needs – self.

Christians, need to accept they need Jesus, be willing to grow and change if they truly are in Christ.

There is conflicting Biblical interpretation of how you can’t lose your salvation if you are a Christian, but that is dependent on you actually being a ‘Christian’ in the first place, which is not as common as people think. I don’t believe every person baptized is necessarily a Christian, or is saved.

If you are a true Christian, you actually feel the presence of Jesus, know the prompting of the Holy Spirit, you want to do all you can to stop sinning, you want to grow, accept all your sins, and be willing and have humility to change and be changed.

Narcs don’t have this ability for any of this, at all.

Narcs keep sinning, as in the case of the narc pastor I was spiritually abused by, who believes he did nothing wrong. And this abuse has been stated as being spiritual abuse by experienced Christian mental health professionals, and I know it was abuse.

So, as a narc will keep sinning, is self driven, is the opposite of humility, is not Christ driven, are they really a Christian?

There is a lot of scripture that warns about lack of humility and wolves in sheeps clothing, false teachers and what it is to be a true Christian.

I believe scripture warns us of these narcs/sociopaths.

And I know I haven’t had so much experience with narcs/sociopaths in the past and recently for nothing.

All part of God’s plan. Not the abuse, God never wants us to suffer. But for me to learn from all this and I have and continue to.

And to add to this as well, is I also believe in God’s grace for people who have a mental incapacity to be a true Christians. How God works that out where any abuse by narcs/sociopaths comes in, I don’t know and is not mine to guess.

Narcs and sociopaths know what they do is wrong, as they hide it and lie about it. But, in some cases, there is actually no malicious intent, as they truly believe what they are doing is okay.

But abuse, that’s different, that is malicious intent whether a narc or a sociopath, they just don’t have any empathy about it.

But, it’s an interesting subject.

Advertisements

Author: Healing From Complex Trauma & PTSD/CPTSD

I am a survivor of complex and multiple trauma and abuse, who at the age of 40, began my healing journey. I am using my journey to recovery and healing, to help others, to help survivors feel less alone, validated, encouraged and to enable others to understand themselves more. Complex trauma, particularly from severe, prolonged childhood abuse, is profoundly life changing. Complex trauma produces complex adults. The journey to recovery is a painful, often lonely, emotional daily challenge and it is my aim to encourage others in their daily battle.

51 thoughts on “Can a narcissist or sociopath, be a Christian?

  1. Pingback: The vendictive narcissit | Free psychology

  2. accepting Jesus is a completely facile idea. there isn’t a person in the world who isn’t driven by ego. Christians aren’t any different. Narcissism is a healthy and natural human emotion. Being a narcissist has more to do with context and group dynamic and the idea that some people have no right to have power over and or control others even though this is what nature intended. Christians simply use a different set of criteria to determine superiority which is that they as a GROUP are MORALLY superior. it’s an old trick. Don’t think the other religions haven’t caught the wave. Jihadists also believe in equality but only amongst the Muslims who practice as they do. Yawn. Boring. At the least the Puerto Rican pride parade has dancing. It is fun to imagine yourself a good person but there is no way to realistically and objectively measure any human behavior or emotion or belief as being right. narcissism is simply a way of being. That others find it painful is a testament to their own desire or need to experience other humans as fundamentally good and their genuine though completely misguided belief that the world would be a “better” place if this were possible. There is no evidence that points to humanity operating on anything but a spectrum. Christ, btw, would have fit the judeo Christian concept of a narcissist to a tee. That’s why they drove him to the cross, because he thought he knew better than they what the WAY was.

    • This post isn’t about bashing Christianity, or Jesus. I find it sad you have taken an opportunity to do this on a post that isn’t to debate Christianity.

      Christianity isn’t debatable for me, and I am secure in my knowledge of Jesus and His perfect love for us, and I have met Jesus. He has revealed Himself to me.

      And I completely disagree that narcissism is a way of being, that is okay. We all have some degree of narcissism which is healthy, but to have very high levels of this is unhealthy and often those with high levels of narcissism are abusive and to condone that is wrong. Ego is a very destructive negative human trait that needs to be managed. The fact that you seem to condone all this as acceptable and the way society should be, is troubling to me.

      Narcissism is very destructive and this is why those who are experts (non Christians) in psychology have identified this when high levels, as a personality disorder, that requires very specific therapy.

      I find what you have written to be very unhealthy and worrying.

      But, it is your view and you are entitled to it.

      Maybe you should find a blog that is about debating Christianity, I feel that would be more appropriate for you.

      • Yes, exactly! And how about the person that wants to debate Christianity sounds pretty narcissistic to me. Deflecting what the issue is about is a classic sign.

        I was abused by a narcissist for 2 years and they are still trying to control my emotions. NO CONTACT and fervent prayer are the only way to begin to heal. This person constantly quoted scripture only to throw it in my face in order to justify his way of thinking which was not of God. He believed he was god and that was so disturbing on so many levels.

        I agree that they are not capable of surrendering their life to Christ in order to allow change to happen. It is sad. And what is also sad is that I believed I loved this person.

        God bless,
        M

    • Wow a way of being a sociopath, wrong. I was married to one who claimed to be a Christain. It is true they can’t follow Jesus. It is all about them like my now exhusband told me once. He only accepted Jesus so he wont go to hell. Self, Self so he is pretty much saying he is attempting to use Jesus as well as he does everyone else. They know what they are doing and know it is wrong but they believe they have the right to do whatever they want take whatever they want and use people. I was abused by one for several years and finally got counseling and learned all about narsisstism and sociopaths. I also believe as I once read this may be called a disorder but any mental or any type of disorder is now labeled as suich. However in bible times it was demons and I believe that today. Satan really does have a hold of them. Im tired of Christians telling me to pray for my ex God can change him. They do not want to change they like themselves just the way they are.

      • If I tell you my story you will cry. I’ll tell you later. It is a long story. But to make a long story short. I had a relationship through the internet with a woman from Miami ( I live in Brazil) I even prayed with her every night on the webcam. Later her sister told me that she is a prostitute in Miami.

    • U need to go somewhere as u defend narcissism with ignorant blanket statements, in true NSPD form.

  3. this was an outstanding article!!! very helpful to me as I am married to one. You hit the nail on the head with everything……I have recently surrendered to the ministry and my spouse would only support me if I didnt bring up my past. I thought “How narcissistic of you to think you know better than GOD what I should and should not bring up?” GOD had already revealed to me that HE wanted to use something from my past. He is a pathological liar, takes absolutely no responsibility whatsoever for anything, it is ALWAYS someone elses fault, thinks he cannot be outsmarted by anyone, seems to think he is entitled to special treatment and has zero empathy. I prayed for years for him to come to repentance but he has grown so so so much worse. But i remember we live in a fallen world and GOD gives us free will. Some choose their sin over repentance and a new life in CHRIST. I left my husband and I actually feel sorry for him. I probably shouldnt but I dont want ANYONE to go to hell. I believe wholeheartedly he is lost, but honestly i dont think he has any interest in JESUS. Thank you for sharing your wisdom.

    BLESSINGS TO YOU
    GINGER

    • Ginger your so right, the way you defined your husband is exactly the way my ex is cant take responsibility. Lies. everyone else is wrong and a jerk but not him. He even called God a liar at one point so even God is wrong and he is right. It sure is satan that has a hold of him. tina

  4. Reblogged this on Healing From Complex Trauma & PTSD/CPTSD and commented:

    This question gets raised, so I am re-blogging, as I truly doubt narcissists and sociopaths can be converted Christians.

    • True. The characteristic of a narcissist is an unsubmitted will. They cannot and will not submit to God, confess, show true remorse, repent, and accept Christ and Lord and Saviour. They believe they are God. They are the evil one, the pathological liar. Their sins are subtle, persistent and consistent and they continually refuse to acknowledge their sinfulness. It their refusal to tolerate a sense of their own sinfulness and their refusal to submit to God that keeps them under Satan’s control. However, they desire an outward appearance of goodness and moral purity, and will use Christianity as a means of attaining praise, credibility, power and respectability . It is a well orchestrated facade. In reality, though, they hate the light of truth and hide in the darkness of deception. God is a gentleman and will not force His will on anyone. There is no hope for the Narcissist unless they reach the pit of despair and submit to God.

    • I know they can’t be. I’ve been married to a N for 45 yrs, only because I take the vow of “better or for worse” seriously. I promised to GOD! Because of Jesus, I’m a survivor. I prayed and prayed, waiting to see something. He just got worst. He’s on the deacon board, and thinks God needs him to run the universe.. I pray for my husband, but ’til he accepts that he is a sinner, and gets out of Go’s way and lets Him work, my N husband is doomed to hell like all unconverted sinners. God is serious. He’s not some fuzzy santa clause.

  5. Wow, this is truly staggering to read and to see how my spouse is exactly what this discription is. I am married to a narssacist and it has been the biggest challenge I have faced yet. I am baffled at how he fits into every characteristic mentioned here. I’ve been in counselling for 4 years and this last year I finally admitted that my husband is a narssacist. I want to move out and be by myself, he says that leaving is a cop out and if I really loved him I would stay but that he wishes me well and will not beg me to stay with him. I have seperated our bank accounts, gotten my own car,and am starting to feel liberated by this. The scarey part is leaving because I don’t want to do the wrong thing even though I know that he views Jesus as a means to get to me and force me to say even though he says “you have to do what is best for you”. He has no conviction about porn or drinking or smoking or anything, and does not feel the holy spirit in his life, but I only hear him talking to me about godly things but in no other setting. Please can someone tell me what to do. I know God is leading me and I know He hates divorce, so what do I do? Me.

    • Hi Deb,

      I am truly sorry your husband is a narcissist, because I know how much harm and emotional abuse this can involve and that is not to be minimized.

      I believe Jesus does not want us to stay in abusive marriages. I believe if you have tried everything, counselling etc, and the other person does not make the necessary changes, to remove abuse from the marriage, then we are not required to remain in the marriage.

      I believe, the responsibility for the marriage failure lies with the abusive spouse, so therefore, the spouse that is leaving due to being abused and not treated with the love God requires within a marriage, is not the one failing the marriage.

      We are allowed as Christians, to expect to be treated with respect, dignity, love and compassion.

      It is a fact that narcissistic people, rarely change and have little capacity to change.

      We have a right to be safe, and not abused and not treated badly and not be pressured into staying in an abusive marriage. God won’t think badly of someone needing to leave a marriage that is toxic. He has great compassion for us and will understand. he knows our hearts and that’s what matters.

      Please don’t be pressured by religious people into staying in an abusive marriage.

      I hope that helps and again, please know I understand narcissistic abuse and how covert and manipulative it can be.

      xx

      • I wish that I could truly believe that GOD wants me free from this kind of abuse. I won’t speak about any of the rest of you because you have your own walk with GOD. I have been with a narc for seven years ( married for five). It didn’t take long at all for him to show his narc colors to me in the first several months of our relationship. I won’t call them his true colors because I don’t choose believe that GOD created him to be that way. Anyway, I left my husband two years ago drawing a line in the sand. Since then, I have had to depend on him financially in different ways because I’ve either been unemployed or unemployed and going to school at the same time. Life has not been easy since I left him and I still find my self being too dependent on him. Is this GOD’s way of telling me that HE’s not done with our relationship, yet? Or, do I just need to work and go to school at the same time? I’ve been confused. Sometimes I wonder if I should have nothing to do with him at all except sharing our 5- year old son with him. And, work, and trust GOD to make a way for us financially. Or, should go back to this relationship and endure the abuse. Could GOD be calling me to endure the abusive relationship? My son and I have also gone through some other tremendous trials in addition to the financial struggles, since I separated from his father. It’s almost been a scene out of the book of Jonah. Do we, as Christians, have any right, except to love GOD and obey HIM and, love others?

      • I don’t believe God wants us to endure any abuse. If it is not going to stop, then God will want us to remove ourselves from this abuse. God doesn’t want anyone to suffer. Or stay in a marriage where we are being abused. God is pure love and pure love does not want suffering.
        ❤ ❤

    • Deb, I think you would be better off on your own. Before it gets physical. I had enough bruises before I started to wake up. They dont change and “it doesn’t get better” I prayed about it for a long time but it was my ex who called me from work and said he wanted a divorce, I told God I was so sorry I know he hates divorce. But all these years later that divorce was a blessing in disguise. God knows what he is doing.

      • Deb and Tina, I too do not believe that God wants us to stay in abusive marriages. When he told wives to submit to their husbands, he ALSO told the husbands to cherish their wives. If you go back, you will also be subjecting your son to a form of abuse. I believe that an abusive partner breaks the marriage vows, (to love honour and cherish) and therefore the abused partner is free to leave. Adultery is the breaking of the marriage vows, not just a sexual act.
        Michelle

  6. Hi
    I am a 46year old male with a wife, and 5 children. I realized on the 3rd of February 2013 that my mother is a narcissist, after reading a compilation of internet articles that my wife put together for me. She is still alive – 74 years old – and I have cut ties with her.

    My dear wife always believed that there was something wrong with my mother – I did not fully believe her (my wife) until I read the articles, and was able to put a name to it. I can now see that this was the case, and that she (my mother) is totally narcissistic.
    I do not want to go into the details, but just a few examples from my life as child:
    – She NEVER told me she loves me, never made contact (physical), no hugs, no “closeness”
    – She expected that I do everything perfect. (Got 99% for a test once, and her only words: “It is a pity you made a mistake – you could have had 100%. A week later, a friend of my mother told me that she heard that I received such good marks in a test!)
    – I was always compared to others, and their achievements, and it was expected from me to always outperform my peers. (Not for me – for my mother to boast!)
    – She NEVER discussed any development or critical issues in my upbringing!!.
    – My father “escaped” by never been home, and getting away from the really sick conditions at home. Mother always criticized my father, and she basically hated him! He was never good enough, could not provide enough, was never there for her (narcissistic) needs, not qualified well enough. Nothing about my father was good in mothers eyes.
    – When I was about 16 years old, my 1st ever girlfriend attempted suicide, another big event in my miserable life. Mother’s response when she heard: “Do you want to go and see a psychiatrist”

    The effect of this young childhood days was low self esteem, low self confidence, and total under achievement in my life. I could never make real friends, never able to get into a stable, long term relationship, and never develop as a person. I was always afraid of people, afraid of making mistakes, and always trying to please people. Inside my life was also empty, with no real life goals or any dreams.

    I did a lot of self in investigation the last few months, and I realise that I am also a narcissist – see website link for articles I read – http://www.samvak.tripod.com. I have done a lot of stupid, selfish self centred things in my life, and this can be directly related to narcissism, and the articles in the link. I do not want to go into the details, but through many traits of narcissism, I have done a lot of damage in my and my families life. Today, I am basically bankrupt, I have big problems with our internal revenue system (Taxes), I have not developed a proper career, and I have no job security. I have lost a lot of money on totally wrong investments. I have really treated my wife badly – not going through the details – but it was really bad. I rejected God and the Holy Spirit for a long time, I neglected my children.

    My wife also comes from a family where her mother successfully committed suicide when she (my wife) was only 6 years old.

    I have realised on the 3rd of February 2013 how hopeless my situation was – both with material disaster (Financial and career) as well as Spiritual/emotional disaster from narcissism. I believed before 3rd of February that I was OK, and did NOT realise the narcissistic traits that was driving me at the time:
    – Grandiosity – Entitlement – Lack of empathy – PROCRASTINATION!! – Low self esteem / confidence – NO financial planning – looking down on all people, they are either not “good enough” for me, or if they where better off than me, they where “lucky” or “snobbish” or not sincere. I had no true friends, and did not really fit in to my job. NO true love for my wife – only conditional, with her having to conform to certain “rules” to actually win my love. She was NEVER good enough in my eyes. I neglected my children, and did not plan for the future – always thought there will be some solution for future problems, i.e: financial! I always hid my feelings, emotions and desires from my wife, family and other people – living to my inside only. I made STUPID and COSTLY decisions without consulting people, friends of wife. My life was a mess for 46 years – and I never thought of it that way – always thought I was OK and right and I am now reaping the rotten fruit of this!

    Today – my life is a total disaster in almost all aspects.
    I did grow up in a “Christian environment”, but Christianity for my mother was to go to church to show that you are there, but at home NO Christian principles where taught. It was an outward show, with deep sorrow inside. Set of “rules”, without any love or empathy!

    I am so uncertain about Jesus, God and my situation.

    I have became aware of a lot of sins (things I did, and things I did not do) that I committed during the 46 years of my miserable life. I believe that the Holy Spirit made me aware of them on and since 3rd of February. I have repented to Jesus, but I wonder if it is true repentance, or just a feeling of sorry, or a way to try and manipulate God. (I know God is sovereign, but I still try and manipulate Him – that is how it feels)
    I can also now see in hindsight how, on many occasions, I disregarded and did not listen to the Holy Spirit and made absolutely stupid decisions where the Holy Spirit clearly spoke to me.
    I am so confused about my own sincerity – been a narcissist – I want to change my life, but struggle to really put my faith in the Lord. I feel like I am trying to “manipulate” God into helping me through the financial, career and physical disaster that is currently upon me and my family. (Looking at sequestration, losing everything, not been able to provide for my family, court and possible convictions)
    I have read a lot about God, Jesus as saviour, and having a relation with Jesus. As in your article, it is all in my head at the moment, but I can not really give my hart. I realise that Jesus salvation is spiritual, but I also expect some miracle to resolve the (Earthly) things I totally messed up.
    I really want to be saved and build my life a relationship with God. I (now) realise how much I have lost in my life by not following Jesus. I can now also clearly see the difference in the light and the dark, and that Jesus meant for us to live in the light.
    I really want to live the life Jesus intended for me to live – I really want to be free from the dark side of narcissism – I understand the plan that God has for salvation, and I believe that the Bible is the work of God to guide us on earth.
    I am sick – narcissist – and I do not see a way forward. I have given up hope due to financial disaster, procrastination in my career, realising how sick my miserable life was up to now. I am praying to Jesus for a way out, but it feels in sincere and I do not really know how to fully give over to Him!
    I do not know how to move forward!!

    • Chris, thank you so much for sharing this all with me.

      It takes great courage to share this and I would like to start by saying that I am so sorry you endured a childhood with no love and a narcissistic mother, as I know how this feels and it does cause damage in many ways. You didn’t deserve that.

      I am also deeply thankful that you do have faith and you do have a relationship with God and whilst that may feel not sincere, is it something that can develop and will be so deeply healing for you.

      It takes a lot to know our own issues and our own darker sides, and I have had to address mine too. God knows your heart and He knows that you have barriers and challenges, but He will be working in you to help you to heal these scars from your childhood.

      I think much of what you have spoken of is unhealthy ways of living, that have affected you and others and it is truly so good that you do see this. I too have had many unhealthy ways of coping and living in the past and have needed to address this.

      The fact that you have insight and remorse for your past actions, shows to me, there is much hope and much growth you can achieve and much healing.

      It is never too late to address what we have done, our sins, our lifestyle and how others have been hurt along the way and how to deal with that. God is a God of compassion and love and mercy and He just wants us to give Him a little and build upon that.

      You and I may have different challenges, but in some ways they are similar, they both come from a place of deep hurt and a childhood that we didn’t deserve.

      My advice Chris, would be to seek Christian counselling with someone who understands childhood trauma and being raised by narcissists and the many deeply impacting consequences of this. I need counselling for my deep scars from my childhood too and it was the best decision I made. I couldn’t be healing without it.

      I believe you can achieve healing through Jesus, and I believe you are already on that path and it won’t be a quick one, it will take time, but it will be worth it.

      I sincerely wish you much healing Chris and I want you to heal and develop your relationship with God, so please don’t give up.

    • First, no one can manipulate God. Impossible.
      Second, people have to fix themselves sometimes before they assist or help others.

      Now it is a matter of a faith based psycologist and pushing yourself to go to every appointment for at 3 months then maybe every other week. It takes a while for us to let down barriers and walls of trustlessness and manipulation. Then ask them to refer you to a psyciatrist (if needed) so medication can help us cope with common associated diseases such as; anxiety disorder, depression, adhd, etc.

      Lastly, believe in your praying abilities!
      Amen Brother +
      God Bless +

      • Amen! Somebody finally said it. Noone can manipulate God.” I have experienced a lot of what you did, especially with the un-loving narcissist mother. THEN I married a man I thought was a Christian, but piece by piece the house of cards fell apart. Terribly, I married into a narcissistic family. Talk about hypocrisy. BUT God in the name of Jesus has kept me til today. I’ve been married 45 years to this poor man, and I trust God with my all. If you and your wife are still together, you need to set up “barriers” and stop supplying her narcissistic supply. For example, when my husband starts to demean me with his talk, I simply let him know my feeling by leaving the room. I even left the church he belongs to. (The word of the Lord was being twisted up, there was just a form of religion. The Lord has blessed me through this man, and keeps me safely. Don’t give up on Jesus, or doubt Him. In stead, study your Lord’s words, and reap the Lord’s blessings.

    • Hi. I am just about a year late replying to this and hope you are doing better, but I just found this site. I just wanted to reassure/remind you that God’s mercy is endless and I don’t think you are a narcissist but if you are, that is like a birth defect and God doesn’t punish people or send them to hell because of a birth defect. We are all narcissistic to a point, it’s human nature, we have an ego, but when it begins to interfere with your life, you have a problem. If you are a 46 year old male, it sounds to me like you had a mid life crisis which is not an unforgivable sin. (If it was there wouldn’t be any men in heaven) The fact that you care enough to write this and worry that you are trying to manipulate God tells me you are not really a narcissist because you show remorse and admit to your failures. That is all God expects. I am not trying to water down the truth but there is a new movement in the Christian community which is the opposite of Christianity where people judge and point out everyone else’s sins yet don’t see their own. I think most people have at some point tried to use some form of manipulation in our prayers even though we know intellectually we can’t manipulate God. God meets you where you are. Seek and you will find. If you ever accepted Christ I believe you are saved. Try to do your best and things will fall into place. Best wishes and a prayer for you. Merry Christmas.

    • Chris, I don’t think you are a narcissist, not an incurable one anyway because a true narcissist can’t or won’t ever seek help, mourn their sins, admit they have a problem, show remorse, etc. and you just have. My husband’s mother is a total narcissist and it has caused him to behave in a narcissistic way for a period of his life but I think when your parent is one, you pick up some of those traits but you are fixable. My husband was exactly like you. His father’s death was the trigger. He started drinking BAD like a bottle of vodka a day, quit his GOOD job, had 2 affairs resulting in 2 children by 2 different women in 2 different countries, told me I duped him into marrying me by pretending to be a fun person, abused me sexually and ended up selling everything he owned just to survive in a cheap flophouse on skid row. Of course both of the women dumped him when he ran out of money, and he was living on the street. His mother wouldn’t help him, his sister wouldn’t help him, he started reading the bible. I finally took him in because I can’t even leave a stray cat outside let alone someone I loved. (Yes I am an enabler) but I set boundaries which he respected. No drinking or you are out. No porn or you are out. Treat me with respect or you are out. He is now the sweet man I married, and has been for the last 6 years. I DO believe he is saved. He got his job back, helps to support me both financially and emotionally, and has a fairly good relationship with both his children, though naturally they are closer to their mothers at least they know they have a Dad who cares about them. I think there are degrees of narcissism in all of us but it is only incurable when it is to the point they can’t self-examine and have no clue or desire to change. I believe that God can do anything so I will never give up and stop praying for them, but only by His grace will He decide if they are “fixable”.

  7. I was in a relationship with a narcissist/sociopath for a little over a year. Just this month, I decided to let him go. I cannot cure him. I’m not a Dr nor God. Only he can heal himself. I’ve seen it in his eyes that, he doesn’t like what he has become but can’t seem to stay away from it. He’s currently serving time for domestic violence. I know I’m not alone on this but because I don’t have my friends close by nor family members that I can run to, I feel alone. I pray for my ex to be healed though it might not be possible for him to turn to God but I know only he can heal him. In fact he uses God for his image. He even invited me to attend the prayer with him at this church. Later on, he “accidentally” revealed to me that, he goes there for the money that he receives from the people. I said, that’s very evil. Have you no shame! he laughed. Chris’s story is EXACTLY how my ex is. There were signs from the beginning of our relationship, but I didn’t know what to make of it. God surely has his ways of opening our eyes. I’ve been praying for wisdom. For Him to give me strength to move on w/o the father my baby. What’s funny is that, as I was writing to my ex, I wanted to add words from God so I looked up verses, I don’t remember how I got to the Sociopath, Psychopath, Narcissist pages but it took me there. I’m now able to pin-point exactly whats wrong with him. My ex has told me in several occasions that he has mental issues. He never told me what type. He did see therapists before for another domestic violence class from his previous relationship. That therapist told him, you have mental issues. I have a feeling that he might have been diagnosed but didn’t want to tell me. Among the signs that were disturbing to me were, he kept asking me to read the books, The Law of Attraction, Law of Seduction & 50th Law of Power. I finally looked into. Those books to me can either be put to good or bad use. Cunning, manipulative etc. is EVIL! One should not have to manipulate to his/her way. I finally came to the realization that, his words of, I Love You’s were not true. Besides, they only come before & after sex. As a thank you?! hahaha. Since the beginning of our relationship, I’ve never felt secure about his sincerity. Something always happens that lead me to doubt. Then, I started to see the bigger picture..he’s not just weird, something is definitely wrong with this boy. A lot of things that he told me about his mother are true. She’s kind & giving to everyone else who hasn’t crossed her line. She’s really bad when it comes to her son. I believe she’s a narcissist herself. She told me that the only thing that matters in a relationship is MONEY because that’s usually the problem. (not for me lady, respect & true love..i don’t care if we were poor.) He was verbally & physically abused. He was exposed to lies by her mother & other family members. Uncles who have initiated to providing him with meths. He has been a delinquent since the age of 13. From the age of 7 mo.-7 yrs old he thought his aunt was his mother. In short, his poor childhood, now reflects his current being. As a mother, I strongly believe that when your child is needy, emotional & troublesome, that child needs the most love. You don’t kick them out, especially as a teenager. That child will have the tendency to turn the wrong direction. My ex suffers from abandonment issues…I’m taking it day by day. I know I have to hurt before the healing can begin. I’m taking this as a lesson to be learned. God gave him to me for a reason. A lesson for me to learned.

    For the women out there reading this, remember, don’t reveal too much of yourselves. Sociopaths are predators. I’m now 36 yrs old, and for the 1st time in my life, I actually allowed him to court me. Never did I like courtship. I don’t like it because for me, it’s a form of manipulation. Honeymoon at 1st that turns to nightmare. It doesn’t happen to everyone but, it does happen. I stand with being REAL & TRUE from the very beginning. If it’s too good to be true, it probably is!

    “We can find other partner, but our children are irreplaceable”

  8. I am currently in the process of divorcing what I have found out to be a narcissistic sociopath with whom we have a small child. Reading this blog and comments has revealed so much commonality and insight. My husband treated me like the queen of the universe before we married…I was a virgin, living life for God and he (husband) came along to show me that he was The One. He treated me so well that I could’nt clearly see through the signs. It all came out when I was 7 months pregnant. He has said things that made me know that he knew he was doing something that I did not deserve. He knew how he had manipulated me and he really didn’t want to mess things up. As soon as he made the decision to stop believing in Christ, things got more and more dangerous emotionally and ultimately physically. God showed me what would happen to him if he chose to continue this path of leaving the love of Christ. When I explained it to my husband, he rejected it and used it as an excuse to remove his ring. Deep down he knows the truth and I believe God wants to save him. He would say ‘Why couldn’t I just get it.’ This hurts me to my soul. I just want God to heal him. I think ppl with this disorder are angry with God for their upbringing (he too has a narcissist mother whom he resents) and don’t know why they can’t get over the hurt. I believe this disorder is a demonic stronghold. He now has control over his next victim who is only 22 years old and is now 4 months pregnant. She is a prototype of me which really freaked me out. I just got this information a week ago. Her family is reaching out to me to figure out how to help. His abuse has maximized and is more outrageous than it was with me. Please pray for everyone’s safety. Glad to know I’m not alone in these experiences.

  9. Pingback: I start doubting Tracy was ever truly a Christian--so it's okay to separate myself from her fellowship--Tracy's Reign of Terror: True Story of Narcissism, Bullying, Domestic Violence and Child Abuse, Part 90 | Nyssa's Hobbit Hole

  10. If you are a true Christian, you actually feel the presence of Jesus, know the prompting of the Holy Spirit, you want to do all you can to stop sinning, you want to grow, accept all your sins, and be willing and have humility to change and be changed.

    This sums it up for me, and for my experience. I believe and experience salvation to be an ongoing process.

    As for my Master Jesus, I do feel tender mercy and patience as I have strived to follow Him more closely. I’m not mad at God for what happened to me, although I know that is an issue others I know (quite personally) struggle with. I do struggle with trust in a different way– I often say I’m cool with God, but I’m quite mad at a lot of His children.

    As to sociopathy, I had at least one teacher, a band teacher, who was definitely sociopathic. I don’t think he was a narcissist– he was more of a raging bully. I don’t claim to be empathic, but I was so sensitive I couldn’t take it like the other kids. During one class session where he flung into more of his abuse, I literally fled.

    • God only changes people who are willing and wanting to be changed.

      Narcissists don’t want to change, they don’t want to acknowledge what they are. And those being abused and harmed by them, do not have to tolerate it and put up with it. If someone is married to an abusive narcissist who won’t change, then I believe they should leave.

      God does not insist we put up with abuse, from anyone. God is pure love and pure love does not say we have to accept being abused. There is far too much abuse and domestic violence (emotional abuse is DV) tolerated in Christianity and people told they should stay with their abusive spouses.

      I do believe in the power of God and Jesus – but we have free will and God does not interfere with that. We have to be willing to change.

      So please consider that – when you are referring to abuse.

    • do you know a narcissistic person that have been set free and delivered. i dont

      • Mrs C…..I don’t either.

        The two narcs I endured at a church – being a minister and his wife….lied denied, projected, manipulated, focussed entirely on their image – all the usual traits, abusing me more emotionally and spiritually in the process.

        The certainly weren’t delivered and set free of their sins, their personality traits and their abusive ways.

        Sadly, he has now been promoted to another church, due to their lies and a corrupt internal investigation. Where I know they will now abuse more people.

  11. Thanks for doing this post, it needs to be known about. i was once married to an evil man, who would try to use religion as one of his manipulation tools. From convincing elderly women, that he was a good christian man..he would then ‘borrow’ money from them and never pay them back. He even used it as his excuse, to go to the place where the hookers hung out, claiming he had a “calling” to preach to them. Now, that’s just two examples of how he used religion, but it was a very common accurance. However he thought he could manipulate someone, he would use whatever means needed at that moment. Religion seemed to be a favorite tool of his.
    He had the nerve to claim to be saved, although he felt he was the one who needed to be praised. I can’t imagine anyone like him, ever giving praise to anyone, except himself. Besides, he felt he never made any mistakes, or ever sorry for anything he done…why would he need a Savior. He was himself his own God.

    • I am so sorry you endured this man. This wolf in sheep’s clothing.

      It is truly horrible to endure these abusive people.

      Yes, these people who are in fact their own ‘gods’ are perfect examples of narcissists. And sadly there are as many within churches and religion, as outside of it.

      I can spot them a mile away now, due to so much experience of them.

      • Thanks for your post. My husband is a textbook narcissist. We have been married for a little under 10 years and I think its time to call it quits. He is an empty shell of a perosn. Being 60, he asked me what love was…he said it was ok to manipulate people because that was a sign of love. He just need to humble himself, empty himself and let God fill him

  12. Ms. C. I am just starting to realize that my sister is one. All my life, I thought I was the crazy one. But she fits the profile to a T. She hasn’t spoken to me in 7 years because I stood up to her for the first time in my life and called her on it when she became abusive to my father. I just can’t wrap my mind around it because she is my big sister, the one who led me to Christ. I am devastated.

  13. WOW. I am so grateful for this article! I am currently married to a sociopath and it’s ruining my family. My teenager is in counseling for depression and hurt and now so am I. I won’t go into too much detail, but my husband is a pastor and, (sigh) please pray for me. I am not sure what to do. He is UNBEARABLE. He fits ALL of the signs. I truly believe he got this from his mother. They do the exact same things in the church.

  14. That was the most insightful and succinct summation of what I have been struggling with since I realized my husband of 20 yrs is a narcissist. When I married him, he had convinced me that he was this wonderful, Christian man. Then I spent the next 18 years off-balanced and confused over why he did what he did with such impunity and apparent inability to understand the harm he does.
    He has become meaner and less careful about hiding his true nature the past 2 years. I am considering divorce but at the age of 63 1/2, divorce is a very scary financial prospect. (Narcissists are very good at making your money disappear.)
    I agree wholeheartedly with Lilly about the Grace and Mercy of our Dear Lord & His plan for those who truly cannot repent and reform. On the other hand, I have to figure out if I can stay married and still be mentally, spiritually and physically healthy by setting up a distance that was never what marriage is meant to be.
    Bless you Miss Lilly. You are proof that God uses EVERYTHING for the benefit of the believers and others who also love Him. Your suffering, for which I am deeply sad, has made you the wise woman & compassionate servant of His truth that you have become. Thank You!!!

  15. Thank you! God used this article to speak truth to me. The damaging thing about this disorder is the blatant way in which they lie, its so bold that you actually stop and try to reason what they are saying thinking maybe there’s truth in it….there is NOT, it is deception and they are MASTERS deceit. Deceit is: the act or practice of deceiving; concealment or distortion of the truth for the purpose of misleading; duplicity; fraud; cheating. So claiming to be a Christian is done in an attempt to deceive and gain praise from others. It is not about humbling yourself before God it is purely used to gain praise for themselves.

    Contemplate this: they are pathological liars… Satan is the father of lies. They are masters of deception and lies, this is how they attack you and while doing so create the illusion that they are good because their ego desperately needs the adoration and praise.

    This (being in contact and relationship with a person who has this disorder) has been the closest I have ever been to evil. They will destroy you and have no remorse about it (unless their fake remorse would gain them praise)

    Last but not least they must be constantly praise so Face-book and other social sights feed in to their craving to be looked at, praised, applauded. Satan the deceiver,, the father of lies lives and works within them with complete freedom because pride is the key that turns their every motive and Satan tells them that whatever they need to do to fill that need is acceptable.

    If you are with someone you think may have this disorder, you have two choices; RUN or RUN. (I was about to say the second choice was deliverance but they would pretend they were delivered if it would gain them praise) I hate to be so strong but I truly believe that they are demon possessed.

    • Praise God in the name of Jesus I was shown the darkness of Narc & Socio in my newly wed Husband of 5 months after waiting a lifetime to marry someone the Lord sent by him being born-again, in deliverance and receiving the holy spirit and also he is a active participant in our place of worship. I have no doubt Satan set me up and I was the bull’seye target! Yes, I am grateful to see the truth so quickly as I prayed for my spiritual eyes to be opened so that I would be able to see what “this” was that I was dealing with in my husband. So many things that have happened that I was picking up on but I had no idea it was this. I guess I’m in the “I can’t believe this, why is this happening!” In shock stage??? When he does things to hurt me he tells me “to forgive him and says”I’m sorry, I apologize … but yet says the same script with the same tone everytime, he sounds like a broken record, like a parrot. He says I have to work on “my emotions” or I will give place to the devil. Our pastor tells me to not give place to the devil and get into frustration about what he does…and I must stay focused on the Lord. I showed him the bruises on my arms and he counselled my husband and told him it was wrong to put his hands on me and he did it a second time and was again counselled and we both participate in deliverance. Both the pastor and my husband say I’m the one who has to work on not giving place with my emotions because of circumstances. How is this, he is hurting me and is haughty/ happy as a lark and everything “Is Great” and I know in my heart he could care less and just seems to be learning how to make everything “look” like he is walking in holiness? Is the Pastor right we just need to work on deliverance and I will just to live with Satan working through my husband to hurt me until he is free from this? Has anyone know or been on who has been delivered from socio & narc? Also I have been wondering about a motive/behavior I’ve noticed: He is not affectionate or feels like it’s forced (like he hates me)usually, but when my daughter comes over to visit he has wanted to rub my back or is overly affectionate to the point where I feel uncomfortable because my daughter is present and It through me off because it only happens when she is over. It is just odd but anyone with an idea of why?

    • oh my goodness……explains my crazy lying , gaslighting, selfish, Christain, greedy slandering sister. Thank You !

  16. Pingback: Can a narcissist or sociopath, be a Christian? | evechoo

  17. Reblogged this on a woman's perspective.

  18. Both my mother and brother are Narcissists and are self-proclaimed “Christians”. My mother always passed herself off as a good Christian woman, a woman of faith, but she was always in it for herself and boasted about her sacrifices she made for my abusive brother and I while we were growing up. My brother is a “born again” Christian. He raped me at age 10 and continued for 9 more years. My mother physically, emotionally and psychologically abused me for years.
    May I add that I am a retired high school teacher and an ordained minister. No one who is a Narc can be a true Christian because they do not know the true meaning of nor can they practice being a true Christian. They can emulate but never “know” what the teachings of Christ represent.
    I am a realist and a pragmatist and I see things as they are, not as they might be or wishful thinking of what they could or should be. I do not wear “rose coloured glasses”. There is good and evil in this world, the only monsters, and evil beings are those who walk on 2 legs pretending to be do-gooders yet, abuse empaths and vulnerable targets. They never admit wrong doing or, accept any culpability for their transgressions.
    This is not a statement of judgment, it is one of personal observations over the years.

  19. Please note I have stopped comments on this thread, as it is often targeted by narcissistic, irrational people and trolls.
    I understand this is a difficult and emotive subject.
    I don’t pretend to know exactly what God thinks about toxic abusive people, nor do I know if they can be saved, or be true followers of Jesus.
    But, the reality is – narcissists, sociopaths, psychopaths are not insane, they know what they do is wrong, they know it is abuse and they do it anyway. And all the cones who claim to be Christians, are not automatically Christians, when their actions/behaviours, thinking and motivations – are the opposite of what Jesus modelled.
    That is something all victims need validated.
    Churches are also magnets for abusive, toxic people……. who hide behind Bible verses – twisted out of context, cherry picked for their own manipulative ways.
    It happens far more than many are ever willing to admit.
    Churches need to acknowledge this.
    Some do, many don’t.
    There are no excuses for abuse, and they will answer to God. Especially when they abuse people – in the name of God.
    Lilly Hope Lucario – Author of this blog.

  20. I absolutely agree with every paragraph of your article, it was both enlightening and disheartening for me; I have been questioning my spath’s true Christian identity! I wondered if he had memoriz-ed scripture, acting the role as needed when he and his wife were involved in the church. I thought possibly he had fell away after his wife passed away and landed in a bottle of booze after many years sober. It’s been as many that he’s been drinking, with intensidity. We’ve been friends for 35 years, We are room mates and like a cameleon, abuses only me, has intensified as well as my knowledge of the illness; After he does all his projecting, vile name calling and blaming me, I can predict.
    his next manipulation – nice – because he wants something from me. He has borrowed money for a car from me and shows no intention of paying it back. I believe he stold the promissory note he fought against and reluctantly sign-ed before he absconded for 8 days, taking my rent money with him. He calls me paran-oid, but I catch him with my property all the time, and he lies even then. I’m trying to move during his smear, rage and attack campaign, distractions, drama, attention getting are exhausting and making me nuts. He’s chased off my friends, my family dosn’t come around, they think I”m either lazy or doing nothing. I’m already predisp-osed to depression and lagging in smart phone communications with ads- I just GOT a phone because he made it such a lying hassle! I think he sabotages so many efforts to abuse and keep me here so he can shout “leave, get out!” which embarasses me, all the neighbors hear. I know their is a hell, this is it and he is Satan.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s